Author Topic: Atheist society = Chaos  (Read 9549 times)

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liveorkill

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Atheist society = Chaos
« on: May 16, 2016, 08:12:28 PM »
Western Civilisation as we know it from at least 2 generations before ours or more ( all users in this forum included ) is the process through which we have come to identify, decay, alienation filth and degeneracy... also authoritarian government etc. A process of a removal of all life affirming values and teachings. Dominant religious traditions removed mostly by process to atheism. Capitalism has sold out christianity to atheism mostly whereas other religious groups already coexisted them and not all of the west is atheist by definition. Chaos is now what heterogeneous groups make up for a civilisation.


Pluto

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #1 on: May 20, 2016, 10:13:16 AM »
Depends on what one means with "Atheism". And also it is a case of correlation or causation dilemma thing.

Atheism in the sense that one is "SURE" that there is no greater moral imperative than the granting of his wishes and there is no greater intelligence than the individual intelligences of every homo sapiens on earth, well in that sense it is destructive. However I want to clarify and emphasize the distinction between factually correct (or probable) and socially desirable belief systems. In fact what is known as atheism is socially destructive but factually more probable in relation to the outrageous insanity of christianity for example. The middle ground between atheism and theism could be agnosticism, but of course agnosticists have roughly the same (lack of) values as the atheists. It's just that agnosticism is what (honest) scientists tend to gravitate to and that's because of the evidence (or lack thereof) about "God".

What I am trying to say is that you shouldnt confuse socially stable ideologies with correct ideas. The best example that could possibly come to my mind is gallileo. The question I have for a lot of non-progressives or non-modernists (which probably includes 99% of the people in this forum, myself included) is this. We agree that morality is disintegrating and one of the biggest reasons is the rise of irreligiousness, intensified since lets say the 60s. Would you feel better in a society that really had a social purpose and a strong moral code? Would you like to live in let's say 50s america with all the god, country, family moronic horsecrap? The US was much more stable back then compared to the bizarre shithole it is now, but would you like to live back then? In my society, I sometimes romanticize the old-style, the more closely related community, maybe what greece was before the 80s. But would it really be a desirable enviroment for me, individually?

Religion is a tool to make the imbeciles (80% of the population) follow some moral code, which is unrelated to the truthfulness or sheer hoax of the religious teachings. I think that the mental elite of a society never really believes in the social myth of said society. I dont think that stalin was a true communist, neither I think that all popes were true christians that believed every "shit turns into ambrosia" kind of baloney they punished other people for not believing in. Organized religion is just a way to threaten the monkeys into submission. And it is useful. But for those who are not monkeys, it is useless, and irrelevant.

liveorkill

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #2 on: May 24, 2016, 03:47:27 PM »
Generally speaking for the whole of society, reverting back to the 1950's like you suggest would probably solve a lot of problems in some areas of society.  I see no reason why I should individually pursue say my christian catholic roots since from my earliest upbringing, my immediate family was atheist whereas other relatives were "forced" in their upbringing to the communion and church attendances.

Atheism and agnosticism is at the root of most families today whereas some practicing christians still exist. I don't deny there lots of healthy atheist or agnostic families too but without statistics, I am willing to bet, there are more unstabble individuals and broken families than there are say christians ones by proportion.

Christian communities used to serve an important role in society by enforcing the importance of family where most were likely to break apart for reasons outside obvious immoral reasons. Atheism has no other scripture than science, right ? I don't see how moderately healthy and intelligent folk can achieve any sense of purpose when he for one, is not a scientist and where most of his values derive from popular conceptions, popular media and socially acceptable values.






Pluto

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #3 on: June 23, 2016, 04:28:00 AM »
Atheism has no other scripture than science, right ? I don't see how moderately healthy and intelligent folk can achieve any sense of purpose when he for one, is not a scientist and where most of his values derive from popular conceptions, popular media and socially acceptable values.

Don't bet on it. Atheism is as unscientific as Theism because like all extreme claims, the claim that some supreme entity created the cosmos, cannot be disproven. In fact Theism is closer to scientific method in my opinion because there is a slight probablility that the claim MIGHT be proven, but absolutely no way that it can be disproven. That's why ppl like Richard Dawkins get their asses spanked in debates about the origins of the universe, because atheism resorts to mental gymnastics at that point. Agnosticism is the most logical stance for a scientist, and that's where it becomes qualitatively different from Atheism.

The influence of religion on the average member of society is surely a source of values and purpose in life, but this brings us to a ages old dichotomy, of Ideologue vs Activist. Activist being the guy that while he knows it is an irrational belief, will promote christianity (for example) for the sake of social cohesion and to minimize modernist degeneracy. David Duke comes to mind and most if not ALL of the "alt-right", who I guess being smart people, are more kind of Jeffersonian Deists or something, not Christians at all. But they push that enthusiastically for political or social reasons. I just can't stand that, for me it leads to neuroticism and maybe even outright schizophrenia where you believe and dont believe in christianity simultaneously. Maybe it is true that Atheist society is chaotic but maybe we havent reached the point where we can have order without lies and hypocrisy.

-A

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #4 on: June 26, 2016, 04:42:33 PM »
I just can't stand that, for me it leads to neuroticism and maybe even outright schizophrenia where you believe and dont believe in christianity simultaneously. Maybe it is true that Atheist society is chaotic but maybe we havent reached the point where we can have order without lies and hypocrisy.

I understand this entirely.

The issue with Christianity is that it has been corrupted. It really is much more than just moral stranglehold of the peasantry, it is theology. This is why Catholicism is so important to people like me. There is a lot of material within the belief system itself that I disagree with but, real discourse has been quashed a long time ago. Then, of course, the Protestant Revolution (the original movement of the people) came along. The attachment is not only in the codifying of morality but also the mysticism and the transcendentalism. Not just habit or opposition to modernism.

With Atheism leading to chaos, a part of the reason for this is the lies themselves. Lying is not what is needed for control, omission is. Wishful thinking becomes canon (as in Protestantism, Calvinism especially) and then much like how a teenager graduates from pot to ice because "everybody lied about the pot" we graduate from monergistic sacrility to atheiskult because everybody lied about the fundamentalism of the lamb lying down with the lion. The only Atheists who could really be trusted with Atheism are likely the ones who are "Ethnic Secularists" and who are not divorced from the possibility of mysticism, transcendentalism and sacrility in and of themselves. Atheism of today, and even possibly ever since it attained a name, has been a modernist wriggling to further justify self-defeating behavior.

JPW

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #5 on: July 28, 2016, 11:47:20 AM »
There's Atheism as a philosophical stance that you can't accept what can't be proven.  I think it's problematic, but not impossible to build a society in and of itself on the basis of radical doubt, but it can be done..

Then there's atheism as a religion.  This is nothing more than applied d-baggery.  It will eventually start conflict.  Nobody likes  cheesedick.  And that is what religious atheists are.  Attention harlot, conflict-inspiring jerks.  The chaos can be ended, but only after these types have been ethered.

-A

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #6 on: July 28, 2016, 10:13:26 PM »
Quote
Nobody likes  cheesedick.

I agree completely.

vir

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #7 on: August 08, 2016, 08:00:12 AM »
Chaos is now what heterogeneous groups make up for a civilisation.

It is always what results from heterogeneous groups; diversity does not work, even in small amounts.

crow

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Re: Atheist society = Chaos
« Reply #8 on: November 18, 2016, 05:17:00 PM »
Atheism is self-euthanasia, unfortunately accompanied by socialism, which demands that the whole group self-euthanize, too.