Author Topic: Christianity: salvation or insanity?  (Read 313874 times)

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Exilarch

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #45 on: October 30, 2014, 06:00:43 PM »
Fschmidt, does God hate everything you hate?

If so, how do you explain that amazing coincidence?

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #46 on: October 30, 2014, 06:26:17 PM »
Fschmidt, does God hate everything you hate?
I interpret God as an impersonal force, so God doesn't hate.

Exilarch

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #47 on: October 30, 2014, 07:32:04 PM »
Fschmidt, does God hate everything you hate?
I interpret God as an impersonal force, so God doesn't hate.
Revelation 2:6 - "But this thou hast , that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate."

Also - how could man be created in God's own image if God is an "impersonal force?" Doesn't that imply that God has a body and that it resembles the bodies of human men?

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #48 on: October 30, 2014, 08:09:58 PM »
Revelation 2:6 - "But this thou hast , that thou hatest the deeds of the Nicolaitans, which I also hate."

Also - how could man be created in God's own image if God is an "impersonal force?" Doesn't that imply that God has a body and that it resembles the bodies of human men?

I am not Christian, so Revelation isn't relevant to me.

I don't take Genesis literally, but in any case all concepts are human creations, and that includes things like gravity and God.  And since these things are a reflection of human thought, these concepts reflect our own image.

Lastly, I have my own ideas about truth, but I am a relativist which means I don't care whether other people's truths are the same as mine.  In fact I would go further and say that for people in the normal intelligence range, I would much prefer that they were Christians than that they held my view of truth since their minds couldn't handle that.

vir

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #49 on: October 30, 2014, 08:23:16 PM »
In fact I would go further and say that for people in the normal intelligence range, I would much prefer that they were Christians than that they held my view of truth since their minds couldn't handle that.

That could lead to political thinking... a downside.

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #50 on: October 30, 2014, 10:37:05 PM »
That could lead to political thinking... a downside.
What do you mean by "political thinking"?

scourge

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #51 on: October 31, 2014, 12:28:46 AM »
Gravity certainly isn't a human creation. We don't even know if it was created. The way the West interprets God (real or fiction) is still up for grabs however. I like to think of God as not just impersonal but not even a persona, or conscious agency of any sort yet It is nonetheless the origin of things like gravity and humans. Call it a Neoplatonic view.

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #52 on: October 31, 2014, 08:50:56 PM »
Gravity certainly isn't a human creation. [...] Call it a Neoplatonic view.
Yes that is a Plato-oriented view.  In my non-Plato view, all concepts are human creations.  There are no ideal forms to be discovered by looking at shadows.

Exilarch

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #53 on: November 01, 2014, 07:04:21 AM »
Lastly, I have my own ideas about truth, but I am a relativist which means I don't care whether other people's truths are the same as mine. In fact I would go further and say that for people in the normal intelligence range, I would much prefer that they were Christians than that they held my view of truth since their minds couldn't handle that.

A relativist? As in, you don't believe that reality is absolute, but that it's just like, yer opinion maaaaaan?

Do you realize you're in a den of nihilists, who believe that reality is absolute and that human interpretation of reality is bullshit by default?

I ask you again - why are you even here? Every post you make is like a new episode of Token the Negro's Trip to the Klan Klubhouse.

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #54 on: November 01, 2014, 11:48:28 AM »
A relativist? As in, you don't believe that reality is absolute, but that it's just like, yer opinion maaaaaan?
As in truth is relative which means applying the word "absolute" to anything is meaningless.

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Do you realize you're in a den of nihilists, who believe that reality is absolute and that human interpretation of reality is bullshit by default?
Yes.

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I ask you again - why are you even here? Every post you make is like a new episode of Token the Negro's Trip to the Klan Klubhouse.
Do you have a better place for me to be?  Since I am a misfit everywhere in the modern world, this place is no worse than others, and better in some ways.  Also, I did almost leave but vir encouraged me to stay.

Lastly, my kind of relativism is about as reactionary as one can get.  It reflects Greek thought before Plato, Jewish thought before Greek influence, and probably Northern European paganism before Roman/Christian influence.

Exilarch

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #55 on: November 01, 2014, 12:07:43 PM »
Do you have a better place for me to be?
I never waste the effort to consider where differents out to go, anywhere that's not where I am is perfectly suitable.

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Since I am a misfit everywhere in the modern world, this place is no worse than others, and better in some ways.  Also, I did almost leave but vir encouraged me to stay.

Lastly, my kind of relativism is about as reactionary as one can get.  It reflects Greek thought before Plato, Jewish thought before Greek influence, and probably Northern European paganism before Roman/Christian influence.

For Vir's sake I ask you to make some kind of thread summarizing your thoughts and beliefs, i.e. to elaborate on the above.

vir

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #56 on: November 01, 2014, 03:42:14 PM »
That could lead to political thinking... a downside.
What do you mean by "political thinking"?

Political thinking: looking at truth as a method of manipulating others, rather than something of value in itself.

Once you go down that path, you may be headed to Joel Osteen. His formula mixes Christian myticism, Randian self-interest and Hollywood emotional appeal. It is brilliant but disturbing.

Can you connect your beliefs at all to conservatism, neoreaction, new right, or identitarianism?

fschmidt

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #57 on: November 01, 2014, 04:20:40 PM »
Truth has value in itself for me personally.  To give an analogy, I value my taste in food and I value finding new foods that taste good to me, but I have no interest in the taste of others.  I don't care what foods they like, but if we go to a restaurant together, I will consider their taste in suggesting a restaurant.  I view truth in the same way.

I don't know anything about Joel Osteen.  What is his motive?  My motive is morality and I will try to understand someone else's view of truth and use that to support morality, but I won't lie in the process.  A perfect example of what I mean is my recent writing on the Old Testament:

http://www.scripturist.org/The-Old-Testament-for-Christians-tp5001181.html

Last Sunday, I gave a copy of this to the priest of the Greek Orthodox church that I attend.  We met to discuss it on Tuesday and he approves of it, so I will hand it out to members of the church tomorrow.  Do you see anything wrong with this?

You will have to decide whether my beliefs connect to conservatism, neoreaction, new right, or identitarianism.  What I believe in is strong traditional cultures with good morals.  I reject democracy, aristocracy, and racism.  I support meritocracy of which a priesthood is an example.  The Eastern Orthodox Church is a good example of a well organized culture, governed by a priesthood that provides guidance for the ignorant masses.

Exilarch

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #58 on: November 01, 2014, 06:01:46 PM »
Last Sunday, I gave a copy of this to the priest of the Greek Orthodox church that I attend.  We met to discuss it on Tuesday and he approves of it, so I will hand it out to members of the church tomorrow.  Do you see anything wrong with this?

Yes, but it has more to do with the Greek Orthodox religion being essentially fake and by default made up on the fly by its pastors and handed down as The Truth to the congregation more than with you exploiting that system to promote your views, whatever they are.

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You will have to decide whether my beliefs connect to conservatism, neoreaction, new right, or identitarianism.  What I believe in is strong traditional cultures with good morals. I reject democracy, aristocracy, and racism.

Vir, you still sure you like this guy? 

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I support meritocracy of which a priesthood is an example.

That's a big assumption to make that certainly doesn't always jive with reality. Have you had much exposure to Catholics?

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The Eastern Orthodox Church is a good example of a well organized culture, governed by a priesthood that provides guidance for the ignorant masses.

Why waste time leading the ignorant masses? Why not expel or otherwise be rid of them and then do smart people things independent of them? What are they going to do, improve those of highest merit by infusing their bloodlines with their prole genes?

I dunno. Vir asked you to stay, but I'm still not sure why.

scourge

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Re: Christianity: salvation or insanity?
« Reply #59 on: November 01, 2014, 09:14:24 PM »
Christian + proletariat = modernity
Christian - proletariat = impossible
Post-Christian + proletariat = leftism
Post-Christian - proletariat = undiscovered country